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By paperdoll (Mon Apr 23, 2007 at 04:02:34 PM EST) (all tags)

I can't seem to stay awake during the day since I started my new commute. I get 6.5 to 7 hours of sleep a night so I think it might be dietary, but I can't figure out what is missing.

I started a combo commute at the beginning of April. I take the train then a shuttle as far as it goes then bike the last 5 miles to my office. These 5 miles are a series of killer hills, so far my top speed going over them is about 4 MPH, and it takes me around 40 minutes so far to make the ride. Then I turn around and do it again to get home. It's hard, I know it will get easier and that my times will improve but right now it is hard.

I need to lose 20 pounds so at the beginning of the year I started restricting my diet to between 1200-1600 calories a day. I have not changed this since I started bicycling. A typical day breaks down like this:

4:00 am wake up
5:10 am catch train
6:10 am shuttle drops me as far as it goes
6:50 am arrive at work
7:00 am have 1 cup frosted mini wheats dry
9:30 am have an orange
12:00 pm have a smoothie with dairy and protein powder
2:00 pm have 1 cup baby carrots
3:30 pm leave work
4:15 pm get on shuttle
5:30 pm get off train
6:30 pm have 1-2 cups dinner consisting of pasta or rice, a lean meat and vegetables
9:00 pm go to bed

I stopped keeping my fitday journal because every day was the same I get 700ish calories before 4:00 pm and the rest at dinner for a total between 1200-1600 calories a day. I conquered the Diet Coke addiction I had and now drink nothing but green tea and water. I can't take a multi vitamin because I have a violent reaction to manufactured zinc, but really I can’t see what is missing from my diet nutritionally. Something must be missing because I can't stay awake.

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Calories by ks1178 (4.00 / 2) #1 Mon Apr 23, 2007 at 04:32:47 PM EST

... started restricting my diet to between 1200-1600 calories a day. I have not changed this since I started bicycling.

I'm sure this is the reason. You've added on 80 minutes of calorie burning exercise, yet have left your calorie intake the same.

So you are not getting 700ish calories before 4:00 P.M. and 1200 - 1600 calories a day.

Unless there was a comparable amount of exercise that you replaced the biking with.

assuming a weight of 180 by aphrael (4.00 / 1) #11 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 11:39:50 AM EST

bicycling for 80 minutes will burn on the order of 800 calories.

since normal calorie expenditure at 180 is 2300, this bumps him to 3100 ... and while consuming 1600 calories per day on an expenditure of 3100 is just barely doable, it's hard, and 1200 calories per day on an expenditure of 3100 is dangerous.

the situation is even worse if he ways more than 180.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

I am female by paperdoll (2.00 / 0) #13 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 12:52:14 PM EST

I weigh 150lbs and I'm only 5'-0". According to the FDA food pyramid site to maintain weight I should only eat 1800 calories per day ever, they recommended 1200-1600 to lose weight. So I don't know what's right anymore because it just doesn't seem enough. I added a mini bagel with peanut butter and an ounce of roasted almonds today and I'm still dragging, not as much but....

[ Parent ]

fda food pyramid by aphrael (4.00 / 1) #14 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:00:37 PM EST

the fda food pyramid site is giving you a recommendation for maintenance at normal exercise levels. eg, the quantity of calories your body will expend on normal day-to-day activity.

when you bicycle for 80 minutes, at your weight, you consume an additional 700 calories. Which means that instead of creating a daily calorie deficit of 200-600 calories, you're creating a daily calorie deficit of 900-1300 calories.

Now, this is doable --- when I lost weight last fall I was running a daily deficit of 1500 calories. But I weighed 218 and had a daily expenditure of 4000; it's much harder to sustain a 1300 calorie deficit with a total daily consumption of 2500.

In any event: the food pyramid is right if you are only engaged in low levels of exercise. You aren't. You need to adjust your consumption upwards to partially compensate for the calories burned while bicycling.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

if i go to the food pyramid page by aphrael (4.00 / 1) #15 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:04:27 PM EST

and plug in your numbers, including "more than 60 minutes per day of vigorous exercise", which you are getting, it gives me a plan for 2200 calories consumed per day.

which makes sense; that's about a 300 calorie per day deficit.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

Cool by paperdoll (4.00 / 1) #17 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:17:42 PM EST

the online fitness journal I was keeping told me I was only burning 400 calories more each day so I thought I was good at my current numbers. Now I just have to figure out how to stick in more calories without junk food, it seems like I eat all day already.

[ Parent ]

: this is one of the problems with high fiber diets. by aphrael (4.00 / 1) #20 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:43:12 PM EST

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

Well by Bob Abooey (2.00 / 0) #18 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:24:40 PM EST

How much were you exercising prior to this?

If you go from zero to 10 miles a day on the bike you're going to be feeling it. Best to start slow and work your way into it - but if you keep plugging away at it eventually you'll have more energy, provided you eat enough.

One further thing to consider - you can pretty much eat vegetables until your blue in the face - so learn to loooove eating veggies.

Warmest regards,
--Your best pal Bob

How's my blogging: Call me at 209.867.5309 to complain.
[ Parent ]

Not nearly enough by paperdoll (2.00 / 0) #19 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:35:49 PM EST

I did a mile on the treadmill at lunch everyday. I wasn't losing anything though not one single pound. The new commute is based more on the fact that I can't afford to drive to work anymore, exercising, and losing weight is a perk. I feel like I've thrown my poor body into a fire, but when the other option is you go through 25 gallons of gas a week just on your commute, so into the fire I go.

[ Parent ]

a mile on a treadmill by aphrael (2.00 / 0) #21 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:50:18 PM EST

would burn fewer than 100 calories even at 4.5MPH, at your weight.

walking is enormously helpful in weight reduction when you weigh a lot more than you do, and it's good for general cardiovascular health ... but it doesn't burn that many calories, even at high speeds, unless you go for a long time.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

Hmmm by Bob Abooey (2.00 / 0) #23 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 02:10:55 PM EST

I do just over 3 miles on the treadmill in 45 minutes and the little computer tells me I'm burning over 350 calories. Do that 5 times a week and you're killing 1,750 calories.

I'm not trying to lose weight - I do it strictly for the cardio work - but it's enough to get a "free" breakfast (oatmeal with soy milk) on the days I do it.

Warmest regards,
--Your best pal Bob

How's my blogging: Call me at 209.867.5309 to complain.
[ Parent ]

: it depends on your weight, doesn't it? :) by aphrael (2.00 / 0) #24 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 02:48:38 PM EST

so you're going 3 mph for 45 minutes and burning 350 calories. this means that someone the same weight as you going 3.5 mph for one mile would burn 116 calories. Which means that someone significantly smaller than you would burn less than 100 calories.
I average about 100 calories per mile at 4 MPH. Which means I can use it to significantly increase my calorie expenditure by walking 2-3 hours, if I have the time. But just doing a single mile wouldn't be enough to alter my expenditure significantly.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

According to my doctor by paperdoll (2.00 / 0) #25 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 03:36:43 PM EST

I'm like 2 Twinkies away from them cutting out the wall of my house to get me to the hospital. He wants me to lose at least 40lbs, which I think is way too thin. I'll be very happy if I get back down to 130-125ish that's where I was happiest with my body.

[ Parent ]

i'm not sure what the 'right' weight is by aphrael (4.00 / 1) #29 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 04:36:54 PM EST

for a woman of your size.

i dropped from 218 to 178 relatively painlessly and have put 2-3 back on since then. :) 180 is just barely overweight for a man my size.

but i go on long walks --- 2 hrs at a time --- fairly regularly.

it sounds to me like you aren't eating enough right now, but that you really don't want to be eating much more than you are. i'd talk to your doctor about your current exercise / calorie plans, and or see a nutritionist. :)

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

: I think he is obsessed with charts by paperdoll (4.00 / 1) #31 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 04:41:58 PM EST

This is me at 150lbs in Washington DC last year. I don't think I need to lose as much as he or the chart says.

[ Parent ]

As a (very) general rule of thumb by ad hoc (4.00 / 1) #33 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 07:50:51 PM EST

it takes 10 times your weight in calories just to maintain your body. That is, if you're 150, it takes 1500 calories to keep your body at 98.6° and breathing. Then, every leg move, finger point, etc, uses more. So 1500 is sort of your zero. So anything you eat more than 1500 needs to be used up to decrease your weight.

Of course, this 1500 varies a lot depending on your natural metabolism and when you're doing things to your body like making it think you're starving so it goes into starvation mode.
--

[ Parent ]

: wierd. by aphrael (2.00 / 0) #35 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 09:01:12 PM EST

i've been told by numerous sources that resting expenditure for me, at 180 pounds, is between 2200-2300 calories.
that said, men seem to expend more calories than women do.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]
: Thanks so much by paperdoll (2.00 / 0) #37 Wed Apr 25, 2007 at 09:34:04 AM EST

I have adjusted my numbers and yesterday was much better. My new range is between 1800-2200 so hopefully I will continue to feel better and maybe lose some weight.

[ Parent ]

I see the problem: by ammoniacal (2.00 / 0) #2 Mon Apr 23, 2007 at 04:53:39 PM EST

You should strive to get at least six and one-half hours of sleep, per night.

Irony: ammo says it's time. Tom is blocked.

Two things by ad hoc (4.00 / 4) #3 Mon Apr 23, 2007 at 04:58:29 PM EST

IAW what ks says. But also consider that you're biking with an empty stomach. You're not eating until after you get to work. You've got a full three hours with substantial effort during the last 40 minutes with nothing to eat.

Replace the orange with something that won't spike your blood sugar so much. Oranges are a pretty pure sugar. You're on a blood sugar roller coaster. Frosted cereal, oranges. You're not getting anything that isn't a carb until noon, and then it's probably pretty heavy in added sugar (if it's a pre-packaged smoothy).

Also try replacing the sugar cereal with something else, like oatmeal or some other whole grain/no (low) sugar thing. Or even shredded wheat without the frosting (add raisins or dates or other dried fruit for sweetness).

Try reversing your eating schedule. Load the calories early in the day rather than at dinner.
--

I had by paperdoll (2.00 / 0) #7 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 09:15:47 AM EST

a mini bagel with peanut butter on the train this morning so we'll see if that helps.

[ Parent ]

loading the calories early in the day by aphrael (2.00 / 0) #22 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:52:04 PM EST

is extremely difficult to do --- the evening meal is the one shared with family.

i figure on average i eat half of my calories at dinner or later. i recognize that this isn't ideal, but it's really hard to get away from.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

Yeah, I know by ad hoc (2.00 / 0) #26 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 03:43:12 PM EST

but there's an hour on the train to chow something down. Biking like that on an empty stomach isn't good.
--

[ Parent ]

yes-ish. by aphrael (2.00 / 0) #30 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 04:38:14 PM EST

i fairly commonly go on long walks on an empty stomach; this pretty much forces me into ketosis right off.

that said, bicycling is harder on the system than walking is.

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

It sounds like she's bonking. by ad hoc (2.00 / 0) #34 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 07:53:13 PM EST

--

[ Parent ]

Bonking? by paperdoll (2.00 / 0) #36 Wed Apr 25, 2007 at 09:30:15 AM EST

I don't know that term. Anyway I added about 520 calories mostly in protein yesterday and I felt so much better. Today I'm also going to rearrange my foods so that the fruit comes right after I get to work and the grains will be later, just to see if that helps even more.

[ Parent ]

: Bonking by ad hoc (2.00 / 0) #38 Wed Apr 25, 2007 at 10:18:27 AM EST

Defined
How to avoid. While this describes a sort of extreme condition, less extreme manifestations are sleepiness and sluggishness.
--

[ Parent ]

i'd suggest more sleep. by LilFlightTest (4.00 / 1) #4 Mon Apr 23, 2007 at 06:56:12 PM EST

try aiming for a little extra some night and see how you feel. if it's the same, then that's not it either. i have a hard time being very alert if i get less than 7, which is often.
---------
Dance On, Gir!

Unfortunately by paperdoll (2.00 / 0) #8 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 09:17:41 AM EST

with this schedule I'm only home 3 hours before I have to go to bed already. I don't want to lose more time with my family by going to bed even earlier.

[ Parent ]

: that's how my schedule is by LilFlightTest (2.00 / 0) #32 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 05:19:02 PM EST

but i deal with it.
---------
Dance On, Gir!
[ Parent ]

Starting a new exercise regime by muchagecko (2.00 / 0) #5 Mon Apr 23, 2007 at 09:22:32 PM EST

as strenuous as yours is probably what's knocking you out. It's too bad you can't gradually work your way into the program you've got, easing your body into the workout.

The only people to get even with are those that have helped you.

O-K, by moonvine (4.00 / 1) #6 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 08:23:58 AM EST

so I don't really have anything to add here advice worthy regarding your sleepynesses at work, but to me, seriously, you kick ass. Total hero- just looking at your daily grind makes me want to change my crazy exercise-free lifestyle. Sex and dancing are just not cutting it.

as an aside, having biked at least ten-twelve miles to either work or school in the past, i can assure you, not only does it get better, but your ass is going to looking even more awesome in the process. f'real, f'real.

Thanks by paperdoll (4.00 / 1) #9 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 09:23:08 AM EST

I'm looking forward to it getting easier. I've only been doing it for a month and right now it's so hard. This morning I actually gave up and pushed the bike over the top of one of the hills. Maybe with the money I save on gas I can buy something to show off the new butt when it arrives.

[ Parent ]

if that's the case ... by BlueOregon (2.00 / 0) #12 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 12:43:41 PM EST

Sex and dancing are just not cutting it.

If that's the case, then you're not doing it right ...

That out of the way, I, too, can respect that highly-discipline schedule and motivation -- it's the thing I look at and say to myself, "Self, didn't you want to do something similar ... exercise, go to sleep early, get up early, use your time and not waste it?" So I, too, want to change my crazy exercise-free lifestyle.

Now I'll just go beat myself up for not having done so.

_
"The german quoting guy is a little bit out there." (fleece)
[ Parent ]

changing your exercise-free lifestyle by aphrael (2.00 / 0) #16 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 01:06:19 PM EST

is easy.

just start walking. half an hour a day will do you wonders.

:)

If television is a babysitter, the internet is a drunk librarian who won't shut up.
[ Parent ]

: BO lives in madison by LilFlightTest (2.00 / 0) #40 Sat Apr 28, 2007 at 12:25:10 PM EST

when i was there, walking was my preferred means of transportation, as it was often faster than waiting for a bus.
---------
Dance On, Gir!
[ Parent ]

ob girl on top for calorie burning by MillMan (2.00 / 0) #27 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 04:17:20 PM EST

Taking the train to work forces me into walking 3 miles a day, 4 if I walk to get lunch (which I do 80% of the time). With no other exercise it prevents weigh gain, and with a bit of work at the gym, losing weight is easy.

When I'm imprisoned as an enemy combatant, will you blog about it?
[ Parent ]

Ad Hoc already said it by Bob Abooey (4.00 / 3) #10 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 10:02:20 AM EST

But what the hell - it's not like you pay for this.

Dachau just called - they want their diet plan back. Seriously - starving yourself is just grand if you need to drop a few pounds in order to make weight before your next wrestling match - other than that it's not the way to go.
You should fuel your body prior to working it. Get some carbs in there about a half hour before needing them. I get up and slog down a bottle of Gatorade first thing - then hit the gym - then slog down a post-workout protein drink. I rarely hit the wall during a workout.
All Diets fail. I don't care if it's the Atkins "All bacon all the time" diet or the South Beach or the South Park diet or whaever the latest craze it - it will fail. Why? Because nobody wants to deny themselves for the rest of thier lives. You go on a diet and lose a few pounds and you're all motivated and then after a while the pounds start coming off slower and you start to get discouraged and you sloooowly start going back to your old eating habits. Then in 6 months you've put the weight back on and you hate yourself. All Diets fail.
The solution is to eat a well balanced diet (see the food triangle thing) just like they taught you back in the 6th grade. Eat lots of small meals so you're not feeling hungry and tired all the time. Excersize. Mix some anaerobic - burns fat and works the heart) in with strength training (builds muscle which raises your metabolism and makes you look toned and HOT - not like some emaciated concentration camp victim. If you want to lose weight eat smaller portions and ratchet up the bike routine. When you're at the spot where the clothes fit like you want then increase portion sizes etc etc.
Eat more in the morning and daytime (to fuel your body for the bike rides and give you energy to get through the work day) and eat less at night. Night time is the time to go easy on portion size and watch the carbs.
Throw your scale away. Go by how you look and how your clothes fit.
Be sure to post pics of your butt when you hit your target.

Warmest regards,
--Your best pal Bob

How's my blogging: Call me at 209.867.5309 to complain.

: 5. by LilFlightTest (2.00 / 0) #41 Sat Apr 28, 2007 at 12:26:59 PM EST

my scale kept me motivated. without that indication that i was losing weight it would have been a longer time before i noticed a difference since the weight didn't come off of where i expected it to. it came off my ass, instead, and i wasn't looking there.
---------
Dance On, Gir!
[ Parent ]

sleep more by alprazolam (2.00 / 0) #28 Tue Apr 24, 2007 at 04:21:24 PM EST

either get more sleep or better sleep. bob's advice is pretty good. and don't worry about oranges spiking your blood sugar. if you do think that's what is happening, drink some whole milk or eat some whole wheat toast with it. it would make more sense to eat the orange immediately after your exercise, that's the ideal time to spike glucose in order to kickstart your recovery. when you start exercising more, you need to sleep more as well. and i don't think you're doing enough to replenish your glycogen stores.

More calories. More water. [nt] by vorheesleatherface (2.00 / 0) #39 Wed Apr 25, 2007 at 10:58:51 AM EST

"Stabbing someone in the head with a pitchfork is rarely beneficial to the relationship." - MereKat

Ask Husi | 41 comments (41 topical, 0 hidden) | Trackback